Comment RE: RBTI Testing Kits

Note: This is a mirrored expansion for the comment posted here.

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RE: Purchasing RBTI Kits

For those of you looking to purchase a RBTI testing kit -- $400 is not required.

• Handheld refractometer -- available new for $25-$40 on eBay or any number of wholesale/supply websites.

• Handheld conductivity meter -- available for $5-$50 on many supply websites and at your local aquarium supply store.

• Pen light -- $2 at Amazon.

• Box latex gloves -- $2 online or at your local drugstore.

• Ammonia test solution, nitrate test solution -- Available for $6 online at aquarium supply websites or your local aquarium store, as well as some chemistry supply sites.

• PH testing strips -- available online for $3-$9.

• Test tubes, pipettes, well plate, wash bottle -- All available for pennies to dollars online, at a local lab supply shop, etc. Sites supplying equipment for children's chem-lab sets are a particularly affordable source.

• Universal Extracting Solution -- the only 'special' item specific to RBTI. Available for $10 at (RBTI associated site) Pike Agri-Lab.

All told, you would be able to purchase a complete testing kit for around $150 at the high end.

Please note that individuals making their living from RBTI will be purchasing these same supplies in bulk at wholesale, for pennies on the dollar.

If you're putting down $400 for a kit, you're paying at least a $200-$300 retail markup.


(Should I add, 'For everything else, there's M******card'?)


Taylor/Hobson

Comment Links: Jim Daily, etc.

Mirrored from the comment posted here, in response to Hypoglycemia - It's Not All in Your Head, It's All in Your Urine'

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**For those just tuning in, there is an extended comment thread discussing the background of RBTI, including personal testimonials, in the comments of the previous post here.

Matt ~

Thanks for your response and addressing some of my questions. In the interest of continuity and keeping the thread from getting aged out, I'm responding here.

Yes I was aware of much of that. Not all. Even some of the people that claim to have great results from Reams like Jim Daily still kinda thought Reams was a whack job.

Are you referring to the same Jim Daily who offers the first-person testimonial for Carey Reams on Youtube? If so, I'd like to include that Jim is the owner of Daily MFG, a supplement company he began solely to manufacture and distribute supplements designed by Reams.

The company has an annual revenue between $2.5 - 5 million and has been in existence since the mid-70s. Daily is on record in multiple instances as having sought out classes on the RBTI method for the cost of $2500 (adjusted from the 1970's, it would be the equivalent of approx. $8000) BEFORE receiving any treatment or experiencing positive effects.

(Please review the 'sunk cost fallacy' and 'confirmation bias' for why this is important:

http://sunk-cost.behaviouralfinance.net/

wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias )

He was later paid to teach lectures on the material, traveled with and assisted practitioners, and was in general a close business associate of Reams'.

•  Daily MFG website: www.daily-mfg.com/index.html

• Explanation of Daily's invention for Reams: daily-mfg.com/documents/making%20mincol.pdf 

• Video of Daily RBTI lecture: daily-mfg.com/videos/lesson%204.html 

•  Company profile on Manta: manta.com/c/mm7f8wz/daily-manufacturing

Considering the above, the assertion that Daily thought Reams was a "whack job" or that he can offer a balanced testimonial in any regard seems pretty doubtful.

I'm not looking to make a character judgment on Reams or Challen

Neither am I. You'll notice that I never mentioned Reams' character or personal life in my findings, only factual evidence and associations that raise valid questions of credibility, accountability, legality, motivation and expertise.

or say that Challen's approach doesn't work just because he repeatedly tells me alarming things like "the spirit talks to me Matt, the spirit talks to me,"

I have not said that either, so I hope you don't misconstrue my meaning.

I agree with you that that one tendency is not grounds for dismissing, testing, or even questioning the RBTI approach. I would say the same if you were to report he said, "Vishnu speaks to me," "The numbers speak to me," "Elvis speaks to me," or "The 49ers are going to win next year,", etc. I don't know if that's true, and the statement is irrelevant--it has nothing to do with anything else. Only the facts and results of the method are grounds for testing, not Challen's personal beliefs.

If RBTI truly is a verifiable, free-standing method, those things should be fairly simple to keep separate.

Out of curiosity, why do you find his statements alarming?

So I did what you do when you read fiction - I practiced the age old technique of the willing suspension of disbelief to see what was going on up here, if anything.

Suspension of disbelief is an excellent practice -- for the purpose of, as you said, enjoying a work of fiction. S.o.D. is a literary device, first mentioned by a poet in regards to "shadows of the imagination".

For those of us with very real health concerns seeking information (often from independent researchers like yourself), the process of inquiry is not fiction. It can be a road clouded by emotion and misinformation, driven by desperation, slowed by exhaustion, and fraught with tough judgment calls and financial decisions. I believe you know this from first and secondhand experience, but it bears repeating. This is not a storybook scenario.

In a nonfictional context, a more accurate term for what you're exercising would probably be 'suspension of critical thinking'. The connotations are less warm and fuzzy, but it's a clearer definition. I'm calling for clarity -- not only on the details of RBTI, but also for clarity on how you are discerning if this method "works".

Can you share your process, not just your conclusions and endorsements?

PART 2

And the most convincing things I've seen are real clients who have seen their cancer come and go depending upon whether or not they were adhering to Challen's advice,

Those would be impressive results. The first questions that come up are:

- Were they first diagnosed with cancer by a doctor, another practitioner, or by Challen himself?

- Have you spoken with these cases, or heard about/looked at files secondhand?

- Can the cases you've seen be verified through third-party evidence such as changes in scans or blood test results, or are they anecdotal?

- Were they undergoing any other treatment or protocols in conjunction with RBTI?

- Does Challen have enough of a sample pool to account for spontaneous remission, if you were to do an analysis?

- Does Challen acknowledge that spontaneous remission exists?

several people who went from having numbers all over the place to having them very tight around the ideal

This brings up a very important question, which you might want to ask Challen: Is it true that sometimes, having "perfect numbers" means you're close to death?

(This is repeated by Reams and throughout the RBTI material, even by practitioners who otherwise contradict each other.)

Challen is 5'8" with crooked teeth and a bunch of fillings and his two sons are 6'2" None of them have had braces or cavities. They look truly amazing. The youngest girl has perfect teeth and looks like she is nearly 6 feet tall.

Yes, most of us do take notice of tall, pretty people with nice teeth. Shout-out to good old W.A. Price. :-) There are a lot of confounding factors there that can't be verified, though--from the genetics of his wife and both their parents, to his younger physical traits, to what his kids will look like when they're his age, to the presence of simply good nutrition irrespective of "the numbers".

(And of course, that old stickler: luck of the draw. Nutritional eugenics aside, some people are just born hale and good-looking.)

Related to my previous questions and comments -- do you know how to set up a double-blind trial?

Taylor/Hobson

Comment: Dr. Carey Reams Background

Mirrored from the comment posted here, in response to the post 'RBTI - Challen Waychoff Delivers'

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(This is the poster formerly known as Hobson--my last set of posts got mucked up in order, trying again.)  


I found out some interesting things through my curiosity about RBTI, which is what had led to my previous comment calling for more critical thinking on the method. 

Considering the fact that Matt is encouraging people not to do any background reading before diving into RBTI and sources of information are obscure, I thought it might be helpful to post some of the things I found here. When people tell me not to look in a box, I almost always have to take a peek. ;-)

(Matt ~ I don't even know if you're aware of some of this information, so hopefully it will be of use to you as well.)

Since I'm very protective of my health (and financial resources!), I like to know exactly where any health protocol or practitioner is coming from before jumping on any wagons. I'm guessing some of you do, too, and a lot of this information isn't readily available without some time and effort. So I'll just lend you some of mine. ;-)

Some of what you're about to read is a bit disturbing. Not everyone will be able to chew through all of it. I encourage you to try, and ask lots of questions--of me and anyone else!

I will be including links wherever possible.


DR. CAREY REAMS




Originator of the Reams Biological Theory of Ionization system. Much of the information available on his background and qualifications is vague and/or directly contradictory, so this chronology jumps around a bit. 

He was born in Florida in 1910 or 1904, depending on where you read. His father was an agricultural contractor and citrus farmer, and Reams helped run the family business in his teens.

In the early 30's, Reams studied for a time as a premedical student in college.

Though he was not a doctor or even finished with a science-related degree, he somehow established a "medical laboratory" during his first year of college to help with costs. The name of this laboratory, which he claimed was "the first of its kind in the southeastern United States," can not be found/is never mentioned.

Information on his premed schooling in the mid-'30s is vague; apparently he did not progress on to medical school due to mental health issues and the explanation that he was "unable to buy his way into medical school". Whether or not he finished a Bachelor's degree in science or any other subject is unknown.

He also claimed to have gone to school to become a dietitian instead, once his medical school goals were thwarted. 



PART 2


He apparently switched his focus to taking classes in agriculture in the mid-30s, sold his "medical laboratory", and opened an "agriculture engineering firm" instead. Again, it is unknown whether he actually completed any actual degree in agriculture.


There are very few details available as to the real function of his firm. Transcripts of interviews/talks by Reams indicate that the company provided services such as soil testing and mineralization and produce yield-increase methods, as well as for-pay educational/business-practice lectures for struggling farmers. The special sprays, mineral fertilizers, equipment and formulas Reams recommended were available only through his company. 




(Note: This was at the height of the Great Depression and Dust Bowl years in the United States. Farm and agricultural commodity prices were plummeting, and millions of acres of topsoil were literally blowing away due to drought and erosion. In response, the US government was pouring large amounts of money into grants and research programs to address agricultural management, soil conservation and fertility. 

Combined with the plight of desperate farmers facing foreclosure, this meant anyone positioned in the 'bubble' of agricultural research in the academic or private spheres stood to make a comparable profit at this time.)





In 1931 when he was 21 and still in college, (or the "late 1930's", if you read 'Health Guide to Survival') Carey Reams "received" the 'perfect formula for health', a set of numbers upon which the entire system of RBTI is based. Quoted from here,

"During a period of prayer and fasting Reams received a divine revelation of the biochemistry numbers for humans in perfect health." 

(The details of this transmission will be including in a later post.) 


PART 3

Reams' actual qualifications are hazy, and there is conflicting information on his schooling and degrees; sometimes he signed his name with 'DS' and called himself a "physicist", as well as a "biophysicist", "biochemist", "agronomist", "Doctor of Osteopathic Medicine", and "Ph.D",. He also claimed to have five "doctorate degrees", including "Bio-chemistry, Osteopathic M.D., Naturopath, Zone Therapy, and Philosophy." There is no evidence of Reams completing these extensive and time-intensive degrees from any accredited schools. 

He also claimed to be a longtime friend and research associate to Albert Einstein. There is no evidence of this connection beyond mention on a handful of RBTI-associated sites.

During the 1940s (or 1927, depending on who you ask) he traveled to England to attend medical school at Oxford University. There is no evidence of his purported MD credentials from either of these time periods.

Somewhere during this time, Reams wound up enrolling in the military as a chemist to "teach chemical warfare courses". Promoted to the status of Major, he was purportedly injured in 1945 in New Guinea (or Japan, or the Phillipines, depending on which source you read) and paralyzed from the neck down. He said he was awarded the Purple Heart. 

Again, there is conflicting information--various claims state he was in a coma, received extensive brain surgery, and rendered quadriplegic; others that he progressed to waist-down paralysis, and still others that he was able to walk with crutches. This crippling episode is repeated as a major anecdote throughout his lectures and tapes, as well as by writings of his clients and students. 


PART 4

Five years later, Reams took a bus from Florida to Philadelphia to attend a faith-healing service of evangelist Kathryn Kuhlman. Quoted from here: 

"After the war his recovery did not progress as hoped, and he deteriorated to the point that he was considered to be close to death. At this point, in desperation, he travelled to Philadelphia to attend a Katherine Kumen(sic) faith healing service. The service, later documented in Katherine Kumen's book apparently produced a miraculous cure for Reams, and he was able to walk and function normally. Dr. Reams' subsequent conversion to Christianity would greatly influence his later work."


(Note: Kuhlman's 'healing abilities' were publicly disproven in 23 cases of fraud, and led to the death of at least one person.

Her account of Carey Reams' sudden miraculous recovery from paraplegic to injury-free can be read, along with the full text of her book 'I Believe in Miracles', here.

Examples of Kuhlman's services can be watched here and here.)

In the years to follow, he opened a number of expensive health/spiritual retreats throughout the country and Mexico, touting the RBTI system as a cure for cancer, diabetes, and other major illnesses. He also claimed to be able to predict the exact year and day someone would have a heart attack, sometimes decades into the future. Descriptions of his retreats include the following:

"...It was accomplished by using laboratory instruments and techniques normally used for agricultural testing. Using these figures, he could tell the person exactly what's his condition, exactly where a tumor is forming, and he could predict when a person might get a heart attack. Dr. Reams started a Health Retreat in the Blue Ridge Mountains of Georgia. [...] His success with treating terminal cancer patients, abandonded by the regular medicine to die in peace, was astounding. He only lost 6 patients of the 10,000 treated in one year!"


PART 5

Reams was arrested and jailed multiple times for practicing medicine without a license. When confronted, he protested on the grounds that he was an ordained minister and simply offering spiritual counsel to his 'patients'. He was eventually made to shut down his Blue Ridge retreat and banned from the state of Georgia. 

As reported by the National Council Against Health Fraud: "1977 (Virginia): Steven Fink, 6, died at the religious mountain retreat of Carey Reams, a self-styled "biophysicist" who claimed he could cure diabetes. Reams has been blamed for other diabetic deaths as well."

During this time, he shifted his focus towards teaching the RBTI system via paid seminars and taped lectures, many of which are still quite expensive in their current form. All of his lectures began with 'devotions' and are equal parts religious thought, personal anecdotes, business management and scientific-sounding terminology.

Despite Reams' claim to at least two physician doctorates, in 'Health Guide to Survival', (1976) considered one of the most popular introductions to RBTI and co-authored with Reams, the author states, 

"Neither the author ... nor Dr. Carey Reams is a medical doctor. ... he is not engaged in the diagnosis or treatment of disease. Both the author and Dr. Reams are interested in teaching the health message as it is written in the Bible."

(Note: The author in question is Salem Kirban, a Biblical end-times false prophet who authored books such as 'The Salem Kirban Reference Bible' and '666'. Kirban later turned to marketing health water and blue-green algae supplements when the accuracy of his prophecies didn't pan out.)


Further details on the method Reams used to obtain the "perfect numbers" of the RBTI to follow.

Thanks for reading this far!